IBIS Macromodel Task Group Meeting date: 25 January 2011 Members (asterisk for those attending): Agilent: * Fangyi Rao Radek Biernacki Ansoft: Chris Herrick Danil Kirsanov Ansys: * Samuel Mertens * Dan Dvorscak Deepak Ramaswamy Jianhua Gu Cadence Design Systems: Terry Jernberg * Ambrish Varma Celsionix: Kellee Crisafulli Cisco Systems: * Mike LaBonte Stephen Scearce Ashwin Vasudevan Ericsson: Anders Ekholm IBM: Greg Edlund Intel: Michael Mirmak LSI Logic: Wenyi Jin Mentor Graphics: John Angulo Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov Zhen Mu * Arpad Muranyi Micron Technology: * Randy Wolff Nokia-Siemens Networks: Eckhard Lenski Sigrity: Brad Brim Kumar Keshavan Ken Willis SiSoft: * Walter Katz Mike Steinberger Todd Westerhoff ST Micro: Syed Sadeghi Teraspeed Consulting Group: * Scott McMorrow * Bob Ross TI: * Casey Morrison Alfred Chong Vitesse Semiconductor: Eric Sweetman Xilinx: Mustansir Fanaswalla The meeting was lead by Arpad Muranyi ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Opens: - Arpad: Our next meeting be held Feb 08 given DesignCon next week -------------------------- Call for patent disclosure: - None ------------- Review of ARs: - Arpad: Submit Typos BIRD to Open Forum - Done, BIRD 127 ------------- New Discussion: Arpad showed the ATM Update presentation for the summit: - Slide 2: - Bullets for various BIRDs 112 through 127 - Slide 3: - Work in progress = analog, dependency table, jitter - Slide 4: - Work ahead = AMI Task List - Bob: The title slide will have to be checked AR: Arpad send PDF of presentation to Bob Arpad showed the AMI Task List: - Updated today - Arpad: Biggest change is showing BIRD 127 - Item 22 is addressed by the Typos BIRD - Dual-Dirac might be combined with another - Item 35 may be covered by the analog BIRD - 46 and 47 are about removing keywords and reserved params - Item 18 is not clear - What is the ambiguity between Format and text strings? - BIRD 127 may cover this - Bob: I can check on this - Arpad: Item 21 still has one outstanding issue AR: Bob check on task list item 18, Format and text strings Arpad showed the Analog BIRD: - Arpad: There was some discussion with Scott - Slide 2: - Arpad: The tool will provide the differencing block - Ambrish: What stimulus does it require? - Arpad: This will work in TD or to create impulse response - Params can be passed in from the IBIS file - Walter: The ISS it's whats in the box - The "1"s are outside the box - Scott: The amp must be in the model for it to work everywhere - It is an isolation boundary - The models must be unambiguous - Walter: Then we need a new ISS element - Scott: We have a VCVS element - We also need the termination the s-param requires - Walter: This will have to be acceptable - Fangyi: Where does the TX model specify swing? - Slide 3: - Arpad: This slide explains it - We need to settle the unity gain requirement - Scott: It should say "equivalent" of ideal isolation voltage source - Bob: Implies S11 would be infinite instead of zero - Fangyi: How the parameters applied? - Ambrish: Why not keep the params in the IBIS file instead of AMI? - Arpad: This was the easiest way - We would have to define new keywords - Walter: In the AMI file you can spec strength - This determines impedance and voltage range - Fangyi: This can't be used for IBIS simulations? - Arpad: It has to be in the circuit already - The AMI can override what is in the IBIS file - Slide 2: - Arpad: We could just say the PWL stimuli have to be ideal - Get rid of the unity gain amp - Scott: This moves the boundary into the EDA tool - This might cause trouble in Matlab and "home-built" tools - Arpad: We should not have to say it is unity gain - Scott: Agree - Slide 4: - Arpad: There are questions here - 1 EDA tool generate IR - Decision: Yes, Yes - 2 Analog output to RX GetWave - Walter: - Decision: No, No - 3 Differential conversion - Bob: It is related to rise time - Ambrish: It can come from hardware measurements - Arpad: The circuit doesn't say how it is to be used - Bob: The stimulus would be 1ps - s-param already has rise time - Arpad: Could a model be made that does not produce the right output? - Walter: That would be an illegal model - Slide 2: - Fangyi: How do I know the voltage and slope? - It must be looked up in the AMI - With IBIS today there is no need to do this - Arpad: A non-AMI simulation should not have to do this - The IBIS spec has the same for [External Model] and [External Circuit] - Fangyi: So it only needs a 1010 bit stream - Arpad: Yes Walter showed Dependency Table BIRD 124: - The table has independent and dependent parameters Walter showed BIRD_122-ISS_Subckt.doc - Walter: I submitted an addition to BIRD 122 - Adds 3 "ISS" AMI params for file, subckt, and arguments - This is all that is needed to use generic ISS - This is less text for model makers, less parsing for EDA tools - Also has ISS_Subckt reserved values - Canned subckts for Touchstone, TX, RX - Arpad: This is somewhat equivalent to my BIRD - This makes it only in the context of AMI simulations - My BIRD would work for IBIS simulations too - Dan: Needs to be looked at, customers care about this - Walter: We could have both ------------- Next meeting: 08 Feb 2011 12:00pm PT Next agenda: 1) BIRD 121-124 discussions ------------- IBIS Interconnect SPICE Wish List: 1) Simulator directives